> Shucks! I had it and then I lost it! Using the VX-3000
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amgsport |
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fullperception @ 07/04/2008 - 17h57 a dit: Hmm... strange that the distance of your LED unit to the camera has an effect on the fps.....
The change in position was drastic. At least 2ft. I'm assuming LED intensity was stronger at new position.
One variable I did not take into account, as I assumed its effect would be negative instead of positive, was ambient room light. With room lights on the cam hits 30FPS, but with lights off it drops to 23-24FPS. Must have something to do with cam settings, perhaps contrast or exposure??
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Kestrel |
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Auto exposure automatically reduces the frame rate in low lighting to improve image brightness. If enough light is available the camera will reach its maximum frame rate but room lighting is normally insufficient for this so auto exposure needs to be disabled. If the frame rate drops when you cover the webcam it tells you auto exposure is still enabled.
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amgsport |
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Thanks Kestrel. Sounds like its Micro$oft issue then. CP for the cam shows auto exposure and auto white balance disabled, outdoor mode enabled, exposure set to "7" on the cams sliding scale. I found that max contrast had positive effect, but haven't adjusted brightness. Saturation and sharpness are at 0.
Even so, what you're describing is exactly what's happening. Freetrack still works great at the lower FPS, but theres noticeable difference with max FPS.
Thank You.
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amgsport |
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OK - I've worked with VX3000 some more and found that it does not allow to disable auto exposure. It shades the tic box to make it look like somethings been done, but AE is not disabled.
Tried the VX1000 enable button software trick, and it worked... but exposure sets at 24 and will not change. It will allow you to make an exposure change, or at least look as if you made change, but when you run cam again exposure resets to 24. There is no performance change +/- at this setting.
Any ideas? Perhaps other settings and/or adjustments that will increase FPS with exposure set at 24?? Thanks.
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Kestrel |
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Use the Force Exposure button to set a desired exposure setting that is automatically applied on stream start.
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Gizzmo |
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amgsport wrote: "it does not allow to disable auto exposure"
In my opinion it does, but you have to disable automatic USB-bandwidth, too... otherwise there is no reason for the exposure-slider.
If you cover the lens entirely with your hand for a couple of seconds and then release your hand real quick, you can normally see the picture stutter while the cam ajusts the frame-rate.
My cam stopped doing that, so the AE had to be disabled.
Anyways I was not able to get 30 FreeTrack fps.
MY PROBLEM WAS my good looking, but apparently awful slow, buspowered USB-Hub by Logitech!
The Solution:
Now I use a selfpowered onboard USB-port and it works perfectly :o)
My way to manual exposure:
- toggle the inside/outside switch to "outside"
- uncheck "automatic USB-Bandwidth"
- push the bandwidth-slider to "8"
- pull the exposure-slider to "0" (IMO the only setting that makes 30fps possible)
- toggle the inside/outside switch to "inside"
- apply the changes and see green framerates and mostly green jitter-information at 640x480px :o)
I don't know if this helps you guys, but if you're using any kind of USB-Hub or front-panel, give the "real" USB-Ports a shot.
I use 3 basecap-mounted, flatened "Siemens LD 274" IR-Diodes with a VX-3000 behind a small piece of VHS-Tape... that's a full-blown TrackIR-system for about two bucks all inclusive!
I can't put into words how amazed I am right now :o))
Big thanks to the incredible programmers out there who made this possible!!
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amgsport |
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Kestrel @ 12/04/2008 - 04h52 a dit: Use the Force Exposure button to set a desired exposure setting that is automatically applied on stream start.
Thanks Kestrel. Totally forgot about force exposure. I'll give it a run and see what happens.
Wish I could tell what exposure setting AE goes to with the ambient room light on... its the PERFECT setting!!! 30FPS and noticeable improvement in tracking precision every time!! The room light is not strong enough to be parasitic and does not shine directly into cam lens, but it sure does have positive effect on cam!
Really appreciate your help Kestrel. I'm spreading Freetrack word in the racing sim community. Outstanding DIY project, made much better with your efforts and help. Thank you.
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amgsport |
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More follow up - did the disable AE tick box trick and worked with force exposure, but it had very little noticeable impact. Tried several +/- settings with no luck. Strange thing is I doubt AE is actually disabled. Turning ambient light on and off had exact same positive/negative effect as before. There's definitely adjustments being made by cam to compensate for change in room light.
Are there settings for other cam adjustments that would help recreate positive effects of ambient room light... but in darker conditions? Brightness, contrast, gamma, etc?? Guess I'm grasping at straws here, but goal is to have 30FPS in darker room. Its frustrating because I know the cam performance is there in darker conditions. When I launch Freetrack in darker room it initially starts at 30FPS, but drops to 23-24 as cam adjusts... takes about 4 seconds.
Thank You.
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vranac |
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Im glad that someone else noticed that AE isn't turned off with m$ vxX000
webcams.But thats not realy freetrack issue ,its m$ driver related.
It's sad that m$ didn't aply IAMCameraControl interface settings to this
driver.
But this software is great  Thank you very much !!!
I dont have that problem with FPS ,only on each restart I have to
flash the camera again ).My room is pretty dark when Im using FT and there
are no problems if ambient light is changing(at daylight).I saw you're using outdoor mode,I had terrible tracking with it,try indoor.
I have tried Force Exposure ,no effect.I tried differennt # for sliders
no improvement.
I have pretty good tracking, but some stutters ocured with 3p clip, on the same angle left and right.So I made 3p cap model and as some people said here, it is much better.But now there are some occasional stutters on different yaw angles.In freetrack window tracking is perfect ,dots are small and visible at bigger angle then that I'm using.It's not due the processor power(6300@3.3GHz FT works on its own core).I'm using FT with il2 where is lots of head movement and you loose contact dots easily, with any stuttering.In the racing sims that is not such a big problem I think.
@Gizzmo
Could you please look at cam properties when tracking works actually,
at what value exposure is realy. I know that it works even with 24 exposure.
@Kestrel
I know that you have enough work with 2.2,
but is there any other way ,maybe patching the driver ,force it to use
low exposure setting at start. |
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Kestrel |
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Force Exposure only works when AE has been successfully and permanently disabled. Reports indicate Microsoft vxX000 webcams do support the IAMCameraControl interface. It seems to be a minority of people that are having problems with AE... perhaps due to slightly different models, old or badly installed drivers.
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Gizzmo |
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@vranac
I don't know exactly if I know what you mean, but you can take a look at my properties yourself, if you want to:
As far as I'm concerned my exposure is 0, whatever that's supposed to mean. |
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vranac |
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Thank you both for quick answer.
Kestrel ,I have asked lot of people here on forum and via PM what exposure value they see in cam properties when Freetrack is working. I didn't get confirmative answer that value stays at 0 or 8. Tracking is good even when exposure value is 24( driver set that value when FT is started ). AE seems disabled but when FT is started again the driver force it to 24.You can see that in Gizzmos, amgsports and Karlsons answers.
I made a mistake reading VID/PID and I apologized for confusing you
http://forum.free-track.net/index.php?showtopic=614&page=3#5290
We all have same VID/PID.
I have tried all driver versions I could find from 5.xx.xx.40 >> ....49
But that is not the main problem ,if I solve ocassional stutters I will
buy another camera
Gizzmo that is an answer 
To make blue checkbox white use Enablebutton program ,start it ,
open cam properties and you can uncheck that.Or if you using Vista
there is Vista enabler or something like that.
Did you made a mistake about checkbox you marked red?
That one is for usb bandwidth. |
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amgsport |
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vranac @ 13/04/2008 - 21h08 a dit: ...Did you made a mistake about checkbox you marked red?
That one is for usb bandwidth.
I've always unchecked auto bandwidth and set it to max - 8. Maybe time to testride that setting too??? Also get best results in outdoor mode, regardless of settings. Indoor mode causes a 4-6 FPS hit.
I did a lot of testing with contrast & brightness... found that max contrast and brightness at 0 worked best. I have saturation and sharpness at 0 also. Auto white balance is disabled. How does that match-up with everyone else's settings???
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Gizzmo |
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vranac a dit: To make blue checkbox white use Enablebutton program [...]
I'm using WinXP, and googled my ass off, but all I've found are programming tipps, on how to enable buttons in JAVA and stuff... can you specify the "Enablebutton program"?
vranac a dit: Did you made a mistake about checkbox you marked red?
That one is for usb bandwidth.
It's no mistake. I really have to klick the "red" box twice every time.
I considered both options (bandwidth and exposure) to be connected.
So if you choose the bandwidth manually, auto exposure gets disabled automatically.
In this case you would usually expect the grey box to become white as soon as you activate auto-bandwidth... but some lazy dude at microsoft must have forgotten to implement that "feature" 
Short: In my case the red box disables them both. Auto bandwidth and auot exposure.
amgsport a dit: Maybe time to testride that setting too???
When I activate the auto-bandwidth-box, the slider jumps to 7.
It works, so i keep it that way.
amgsport a dit: Also get best results in outdoor mode, regardless of settings.
In outdoor-mode i also get 30 fps, but indoor mode gives me more light efficiency so I can darken my LEDs, keep them cooler and safe some energy for the sake of global warming.
Just imagine the polar caps meltdown if the whole mankind is running around with IR-devices attached to the heads
amgsport a dit: How does that match-up with everyone else's settings???
Pretty good. To setup the color-sliders I dimmed my LEDs far down, moved my head around and played with the sliders. I kept the position where the white crosses in freetrack flickered the least.
With bightened up LEDs these settings make no difference at all.
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Gizzmo |
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I just found "Enable Button" it is mentioned in the FAQ:http://forum.free-track.net/index.php?showtopic=455
It messed up the whole driver as i know it.
The exposure-value jumped randomly to 24 or 48 and the slider seemed to have no effect anymore... so for me it's definitely better to leave this box greyed out and hit the bandwidth-box twice after each start... this enable button software was bad news for my working system |